Asus P4P800 - the Facts about PAT

[Mikki]

Check it all out here (http://www.bleedinedge.com/reviews/p4p800_facts_about_pat/p4p800_facts_about_pat_pg1.html) and discuss it in this thread! :)

[RotorHead]

You got some front page time over at [H]ardocp....woohoo!! :rock:

30 May 5th edition

Way to go!!

:beer: :beer:

RH

[prometheus]

Thanks for finding this for us, RH. We have GOT to find a better description for you than 'The Dirty Fan Guy' :)

[Skully]

Originally posted by RotorHead
You got some front page time over at [H]ardocp....woohoo!! :rock:

30 May 5th edition

Way to go!!

:beer: :beer:

RH Neat! :beer:

[RotorHead]

Originally posted by prometheus
...... We have GOT to find a better description for you than 'The Dirty Fan Guy' :)

Ok, is this one better??

Oh, and excellent work on the PAT/MAM issue there Prom!!

:beer:
RH

[bushkarma]

Can anyone tell me what's the best, most compatible Dual DDR ram modules for use with the Asus P4P800? esp. if you want to overclock a P4 2.4C 800fsb and take advantage of the memory management?:-) :confused: :confused:

[prometheus]

Well, a 2.4C should OC to about 275 to 300FSB. To take advantage of that with full 1:1 memory optimization would require DDR550 to DDR600 which doesn't exist. This is the reason the 3.0C makes sense where you are hitting 240 to 250 maximum overclock which requires DDR480 to DDR500 for 1:1, which is doable or will be doable very soon.

So the question becomes what will work at full overclock at 5:4. At the maximum with a great chip doing 275 to 300FSB, you would need something that can do DDR440 to DDR480. There are several chips that can do most of this range. If you're looking for value I would recommend OCZ DDR466 with Winbond chips (BH5) at about $100 per 512MB or Fry's generic Corsair 3500LL called Patriot-EX 3500 at $110 per 512Mb from Fry's or www.outpost.com. In my tests both do around DDR400 at great timings of 2,5,2,2 or 2,6,2,2 (2.5 to 2.65v); at DDR433 they do 2,5,3,2, to 2,6,3,2 (2.6 to 2.7v); at DDR466 2,7,3,3 to 2.5,7,3,3 (2.8 to 2.85v). They topped out in my tests at anywhere from DDR466 to DDR480 (2.8 to 2.85v). Kingston HyperX 3500 is also available from outpost for $110 per 512Mb or many other places in the $110 to $130 range, and the newest version is now rated at 2,7,3,3,T1 at DDR433. I was impressed when I first tested HyperX and will be testing the latest version again in the next few days.

Other great choices at a little higher price are OCZ3500EL (Hynix 4.3 or BH5) and Corsair XMS 3500C2 (Winbond BH6). Geil is reported by some to overclock well also, but requires more voltage. Geil I have tested did not OC as well as OCZ and Corsair, but I have not tested recent Geil memory. Several are testing OCZ3700GOLD which supposedly can do DDR500 to DDR533 at more relaxed timings, but I have yet to see a review.

[Thor]

On the home page of Tomshardware.

This line in the conclusions begs the fact, so are all Asus i865 boards binned down from i875? Hmm.

Now, Asus only one more problem left to solve: there are 865PE chips that don't pass the internal Intel PAT qualification tests through speed binning, and there are others that are artificially degraded in order to fulfil market demands. Only the latter type are suitable for stable operation after "reactivating" PAT. Asus wants to ensure this by using strict quality control, and the customers have to put their trust this.

[Ardy]

Originally posted by Thor
On the home page of Tomshardware.

This line in the conclusions begs the fact, so are all Asus i865 boards binned down from i875? Hmm.

Now, Asus only one more problem left to solve: there are 865PE chips that don't pass the internal Intel PAT qualification tests through speed binning, and there are others that are artificially degraded in order to fulfil market demands. Only the latter type are suitable for stable operation after "reactivating" PAT. Asus wants to ensure this by using strict quality control, and the customers have to put their trust this.

For some reason Tom's has pulled this article.It was there yesterday but gone now?????

[oldfart]

The article now says that Abit has a BIOS for the IS7 that also enables PAT.

Update, June 4, 2003: a day after this article was posted, the BIOS version 1.3 Beta for the Abit IS7-G, a rival product, arrived. The initial tests show that Abit has made the same leap in performance and is now at the same level as Asus. Thus, the frame rates in Quake 3 have increased from 366 to 418 fps - this may be a sign that Abit has also activated PAT.
Either that or they finally figured out how to run a benchmark

[triumph]

I've recently bought a p4p800, 2.8c processor, and kingston hyperx 3500 ram. the SiSoft memory benchmark is around 4600 with MAM enabled. the memory is spec'd at 2-3-3-7-1T. does anyone know what the overclock settings should be for this configuration?

[SupermanCK]

Originally posted by oldfart
The article now says that Abit has a BIOS for the IS7 that also enables PAT.

Either that or they finally figured out how to run a benchmark

what's a benchmark??? :scratch:

[Cogar]

Originally posted by SupermanCK
what's a benchmark??? :scratch:
:lol: It's an old fashioned way of measuring relative performance before the manufacturers started "optimizing" their drivers to make things less confusing for all of us. ;)

[Croc]

I am ready to move to the Asus P4P800 from my P4S533.
I have a 2.66B which overclocks well but is limited by the P4S533.
For now I could stay with the 2.66B but I can get a 2.6C in trade for less than $75Can.

I am not into extreme overclocking anymore but would like to hit a stable 233fsb on the 2.6C at 1:1 for day in and day out running.

I noted Prom's suggestions for ram but I have a few questions for those with experience on this board:

Is it really critical to go with "matched" pairs of dimm sets?
I could go to 2 x 512meg dimms but it seems harder to find those in matched sets ( see above )?
I understand the Windbond CH5 chips are not as good as the BH5 &6 chips. Is that true?
Will this board take a Zalman 7000ALCU heatsink?

[Frame]

I have some questions for you guys. I have a 2.4c and Asus P4P800 deluxe. The chip will easily do 3.06 (255FSB) with the memory @ 320. This is achieved with no Vcore or DDR Voltage adjustments. The memory will run @ 400mhz with the chip clocked at the stock 2.4 speed. However, when I try to run the chip at 250 FSB and the RAM at 400, the system will not even post. In fact at times it gives me a BIOS checksum error. I have Kingston Hyper-X PC3500 memory modules, matched pair 2x256 =512, so I figured this RAM would be able to achieve this speed. I have no idea why the chip and RAM will overclock independently but not as a package. I have tried manually setting AGP/PCI bus to avoid going out of spec on a card and causing the system not to post. I have also tried relaxing the latencies on the RAM. No matter what I do I simply CANT get the system to operate at 250/400. This is upsetting me because I paid premium price for PC3500 and it appears im getting the performance of PC2700-PC3200. PLEASE HELP.

[LastRide]

250 FSB and the ram at 400 is 1:1 on the P4P800 which in turn your trying to run at DDR 500!!!.Set the ratio to 5:4 which is 320 in the ratio options.Manually set your memory timings the tightest your ram can handle at the 5:4 320 speed at 255 FSB and lock your AGP/PCI.You will need OCZ Gold 3700 to run DDR 500.

edit: I see you were already running 320.At 400 1:1 250 FSB is not going to happen with your current ram.

[Croc]

Don't think so Last Ride.

250 divided by 5 x4 = 200 ( x 2 = standard ddr 400 ).
Should be a no brainer. Even generic ram should carry that.
There must be another setting that works with the 5/4 to give him that.

Frame should be able to do that on automatic using the 5/4 divider if his 2.4 already does 255 and using the 4/5 divider for mem at 320. I don't get that though because that's DDR 640?

[LastRide]

I had the P4P800 and the 400 is 1:1 250FSB X 2= DDR 500.Read this thread,A lot of people were confused on the ratios.Even bigtoe said 400 is 1:1,266 is 3:2 and 320 is 5:4 and you have auto also (by speed I believe).This is with the 800 C CPU.With the a B cpu it switches to 2:3,4:5 and auto,three settings and with a C chip you have 4 settings.

P4P800 LINK (http://www.abxzone.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=48593&highlight=p4p800+ratios)

[Croc]

Try posting over here:
ABX (http://www.abxzone.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49814&perpage=15&pagenumber=1)
or in ThugsRook's review thread in this forum.

I don't have the board yet but you may want to try turning off Turbo. I am very interested to see you get it work. A lot of other people are having problems with Abit springdale/Canterwood on the 3:3 & 5:4 dividers too.

[Croc]

I think I got it right LastRide. Let Frame answer that.
But at "250" fsb the 5/4 setting should give you "200".

250fsb at 1:1 is ddr500 ( 250x2). 250@5/4 is ddr 400 ( 200X2 ). It's just math.

[Frame]

The 5/4 (320) rating does clock the RAM at 200 according to
CPU-Z utility. Is this the highest im going to achieve? If thats what everyone else is getting with this setup im more than pleased then. I was mislead about 250/400 being 1:1 I suppose :)

[Chuck232]

Well, on the P4P800 it doesn't actally have ratios. IIRC the choices are auto, 400, 320, and 266. They in turn actually mean 1:1, 5:4, and 3:2 in that order. I think this is what LR meant.

[LastRide]

You were running DDR 400 at stock 2.4GHz 200 FSB.Why don't you overclock the CPU some more if it will do 3GHz easy?.Try and get it up to 3.3 or 3.4 GHz if possible.Myself I wouldn't really want to go more than 1.6 vcore stable although some run 1.7V.The less vcore the better but adding a little won't hurt.At 320 3.3GHz would give you DDR 448.Thta would give you a little speed burst.;)

[Croc]

Hey thanks for that Chuck.

Either an AbitIC7 or the Asus P4P800 arrives next Tuesday so I have not actually seen the BIOS but the divider results are the same depending on what kind fsb processor you install.

I reread LastRides 2 posts. The 320 speed did catch me. That setting is the same as 5:4. Sorry LastRide. You did not get a bad mark on your math test after all and I appreciate you not blasting me like I derserve.:wave:

So now I get Frame's post. The 400 setting he is talking about is 1:1 so yah the ram is at ddr500 at 250mhz. NOT! That's what everybody is waiting for. Ram that will do that and beyond.

So yes the 320 or 5:4 divider is the only reasonable choice with the ram he has.

And it is a little confusing. Some of the guides refer to 5:4 which, to me is easier to understand than 320.

[Chuck232]

I just called a store inquiring about this motherboard and the sales associate was very informative telling me that the PAT like thing (MAM) was being hardwired shut off the newer P4P800 motherboards. He said that they got a new batch so he wasn't sure if they were the new ones that were hardwired or just old ones that just came in.

Just thought I'd tell yas in case everyone's still assuming it's got the pseudo-PAT for sure.

I took the chance and ordered still so whatever.:p